Exercise R Us

Question:

I am posting this note to see if anyone could lend some ideas and options to aid in solving a problem with our dog.  I have a 2-year-old; male Australian cattle dog named Max who has recently developed a severe aggression problem.   Max has always been a very willful and stubborn dog but never showed any aggressive behavior towards my wife our kids or me. Lately, though, he began going after my all of us.  He has bitten both my wife and myself when we tried to discipline him. When Max was a puppy, we took him to obedience classes and learned how to control and praise and discipline him properly.  This training has proved invaluable until recently.  If you try to scold him, he evidently perceives it as a threat go after you.  You generally can see it coming because he will begin by growling before he tries to bite you.   Another problem generally occurs in the evening.  Max likes to sleep at the foot of the couch in our family room.  If either my wife or myself tries to get up and in so doing puts their feet close to Max; he will wake up and bite at your feet.  He will not calm down for some time.  This is difficult to understand.  The largest problem is that he recently has tried to snap at both of our sons, ages 3 and 5. We have taken him to the vet and he is physically fit.  The vet strongly suggested taking him to the Tufts Veterinary school for behavior therapy.  We made an appointment but have two weeks to go.  They indicated that he made need medication to alter his behavior.   My entire family has grown very attached to Max but the aggressive behavior towards the children is unacceptable.  At this point, I do not know whether we can wait the 2 weeks for the appointment.  We have lamented over this and are considering euthenizing him since we feel that putting him up for adoption would be like giving someone else a letter bomb. Any answers or opinions would be a big help.  You can post to this newsgroup Thank You Nick Hatzis

Response:

well, i’d go to another vet to make sure that there is niether a brain tumor nor a seizure disorder. then i’d go to an holistic vet for serious help in lieu of the meds suggested (for a referral near you check at http://www.naturalholistic.com) also if not yet neutered DO IT NOW! then start doing dominance work – see suggestions in books by carol lea benjamon, the vollhards and the monks of new skete. get a crate – USE IT, put Max in there to sleep. also do some reading on acd’s remember that they are drovers and max is trying to herd you (the way acd’s drove is by ankle biting/nipping – sound familiar?).  you might see if there are any herding clubs/trials in your area and give max an outlet for these innate drives. take more obedience classes – work towards competition.  it will give max a purpose and you a means of control.  just because you took some classes a while ago doesn’t mean that you have kept it up.  acd’s must be worked on a regular basis or they can turn feisty, if not downright agressive. visit the akc website (http://www.akc.org) and find an acd club in your area and if you cannot handle max anymore, i am sure that they will be glad to help find him a home.  if you got max from a truly reputable breeder, he/she/they should be willing to take him back or find an alternate home for him – perhaps on a farm where he could herd some sheep or geese. best of luck

Response:

>My entire family has grown very attached to Max but the aggressive behavior >towards the children is unacceptable.  At this point, I do not know whether >we >can wait the 2 weeks for the appointment.  We have lamented over this and are >considering euthenizing him since we feel that putting him up for adoption >would be like giving someone else a letter bomb.

You have no other choice but to wait. It is either that or kill the dog. In the interim,. keep a lead on the dog(with supervision) for safety and avoid any behaviors that trigger aggression. Bob Maida Dog Training/Problem counseling since 1969 Manassas,Va

Response:

You need a combination of Zen and Guerrilla methodology to solve this problem.   The Zen of it is to slowly decondition your dog away from using aggression to solve his problems by showing him that it doesn’t work, at least it doesn’t work against you. The Guerrilla part involves using very strong reactions when he does it, or more likely at the instant before he does it, when he is thinking about snarling or biting.  The strong reaction on your part should be much more bark than bite and should not involve physical pain, but should send a strong pyschological message. I’m just going to give you some ideas here, since even I, the ZenMaster, can’t solve this problem in one post.  Take a situation where he likes to snarl or bite,  When you see him about to do it, take a basketball or something comparable and slam it down as hard as you can next to him and scream NNNNOOOO!   The reason this works better than a choke chain (also a valid deterrent) is because it is more immediate.  You can slam the ball (or the shake can, keys or whatever you want) at the very instant!  He is starting to do something he shouldn’t be doing.  Immediacy and intensity are the keys. Then just go about your business casually and when he gets calm, just casually walk up to him and give him a hot dog or something really good. But don’t just give it to him, first present it to him with you hand completely closed, let him sniff it and try to get it out of your hand. If he makes any attempt to bite, you just take it away and walk away.  He doesn’t get until he is very polite and takes it nicely.   You’ve got to completely stop scolding him physically, the time or hitting him or anything like that, since he is rebelling against that kind of treatment.  You have to work the EXTREMES.  Be extremely nice to him when he is good and become a psycho lunatic when he is bad, but not a psycho lunatic who is going to hurt him and escalate his aggression.  Appearances are everything.  This is something I have to demonstrate on video and I can’t really explain it here.  Now, a choke chain, used properly will not hurt a dog, but will send a message, and is an acceptable option here. I’ve never had this problem with my dogs, but I have successfully changed the behavior of other people’s dogs who were very similar.  You have to first become his friend all over again and completely rebuild his trust in you because it has been lost somewhere along the way, or was never there from the start. Let us know what they tell you to do at the Tuft’s school, enquiring ZenMaster’s want to know. Michael T. Zen Guerrilla Dog Changing The Muzzle of Dog Training CHECK IT OUT, PRELUDE WEB PAGE IS UP AND RUNNING ~~~~~http://members.aol.com/ZZendog/ZenDogTest.html~~~~~~

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >You need a combination of Zen and Guerrilla methodology to solve this >problem.   >The Zen of it is to slowly decondition your dog away from using aggression >to solve his problems by showing him that it doesn’t work, at least it >doesn’t work against you. >The Guerrilla part involves using very strong reactions when he does it, >or more likely at the instant before he does it, when he is thinking about >snarling or biting.  The strong reaction on your part should be much more >bark than bite and should not involve physical pain, but should send a >strong pyschological message. >I’m just going to give you some ideas here, since even I, the ZenMaster, >can’t solve this problem in one post.  Take a situation where he likes to >snarl or bite,  When you see him about to do it, take a basketball or >something comparable and slam it down as hard as you can next to him and >scream NNNNOOOO!   The reason this works better than a choke chain (also a >valid deterrent) is because it is more immediate.  You can slam the ball >(or the shake can, keys or whatever you want) at the very instant!  He is >starting to do something he shouldn’t be doing.  Immediacy and intensity >are the keys.

Michael,      This may work for you but these people are not you. They need to take a back door approach. Any aggression  on their part is more likely to trigger a bite     They need to: 1. Keep a lead on the dog(with supervision) at all times 2. Avoid conflict or confrontation. 3. Seek INPERSON help rapidly     Aggression problems because of the lack of visual info cannot be dealt with online >Let us know what they tell you to do at the Tuft’s school, enquiring >ZenMaster’s want to know.

    Any behaviorist they deal with also needs to hook them up with a local reputable and humane trainer. Bob Maida Dog Training/Problem Counseling Manassas,Va

Response: